Faith is belief in things not seen.

[telemann.livejournal.com]

There'll be a public option in the final bill, and President Obama will sign it before Christmas. :-)

Comments

waxing sceptical

[i.livejournal.com]

i'm waiting for the monty python themed one with the republicans blue dogs hitting it over the head with a shovel. "now you're dead."

[soliloquy76.livejournal.com]

Nate Silver* had an interesting take on public option support a few weeks ago:

Estimate of districts that support/oppose a public option

blue = support, red = oppose

• The public option is estimated to have plurality support in 291 of the 435 Congressional Districts nationwide, or almost exactly two-thirds.
• The public option is estimated to have plurality support in 235 of 257 Democratic-held districts.
• The public option is estimated to have plurality support in 34 of 52 Blue Dog - held districts, and has overall popularity of 51 percent in these districts versus 39 percent opposed.

*Appeal To Authority FTW

[annainthecity.livejournal.com]

If only the voters who elected these assholes had as much voice as the lobbyists who buy them instead.

[telemann.livejournal.com]

BadlydrawnJeff says that doesn't count, since the polling was done by Daily Kos.

But I'm amused at the guys on the right that cite the poll as some justification. What was their rationale in January through June when most polls showed overwhelming support for some form of public option?

[i.livejournal.com]

where's the version distorted to account for population like they did for the election??

[donkeyjon.livejournal.com]

The problem with any poll these days is that "public option" is nebulous. Should there be a free medical plan that Americans can use that costs tax money? Well, that depends on the plan....

...if it costs so much that it raises taxes for all Americans?
...if it runs all competing plans out of business?

Until we have an actual plan to debate, all these polls are meaningless.

[telemann.livejournal.com]

Or saves money because it reduces costs and raises competition between providers. You left that option out.

[donkeyjon.livejournal.com]

I left out many options, but yes, if what you say is true, I'd support it.

[i.livejournal.com]

yes to all of the above.
1-there should be one.
2-it will raise taxes, but lower your personal cost by more.
3-if it does that, it means it's cheaper and better.

i'm sure the debate will be really meaningful:
"I now recognize the distinguished senator from the right side of the chamber."
"OMG!DEATH PANEL!SOCIALISM!KILLING YOUR GRANDMA!MUSLIM!911! I reserve the right to revise and extend my remarks."

[donkeyjon.livejournal.com]

Small nitpick, though I agree with you in general: Currently, I have no personal cost for my insurance, nor have I ever had one. It is a condition of my employment, and it is paid by my employer. It is also important to point out that this puts me in the majority of Americans.

Also, like the majority of Americans, I'm ok with paying some taxes to get health care fro those who need it. But I'd like to know how much I'm paying, and whether I'll be able to keep my current policy that I like instead of forced to use the public option.

[telemann.livejournal.com]

Right, most Americans currently have coverage that lets them be dropped, or not cared for existing conditions, or have caps on payments, or prevents them from moving to another job that may not have health insurance.

[donkeyjon.livejournal.com]

Hey, if we want to change this to the "Reform the Insurance Companies Bill" I'm on board. But it seems that the powers that be are getting a bit too much money from the insurance lobby to do so. I can say that I and my family have never had problems in our insurance companies, but I recognize that problems exist in the system and it would be good to fix them.

Although I should state that any decent job I've ever seen has health insurance of varying degrees of effectiveness as part of the benefits. Much like vacation time, it seems to be a pretty standard benefit for any job that carries a decent salary.

Thanks

[jafesq.livejournal.com]

It is refreshing to see a thoughtful discussion of the public plan instead of name-calling and fear mongering. Thank you

[i.livejournal.com]

technically, getting everyone care so they don't use the emergency rooms at everyone else's expense should lower your employer's (and my wife's employer's) cost so that they can actually pay you a higher salary. i don't believe any plan out there mandates plan or doctor changes. from what i heard, the CBO estimates that after ten years, 10 million people would be on the public option. small potatoes.

[donkeyjon.livejournal.com]

While I am skeptical about the "better salary" result, I agree that getting people an option other than ER access would help with costs.

[i.livejournal.com]

correction: so they can either pay you more or hire more people or buy another house for the third thursday in september.

[xforge.livejournal.com]

?? My employer's coverage costs me plenty. If they didn't have to cover me they could afford to pay me more. (Barring y'know, them being assholes, which is never a given.) And most of us with employer coverage pay about a third of the total premium deducted from our paycheck anyway, so, really really not "no personal cost."

[donkeyjon.livejournal.com]

I've had plans that did either. My current plan costs me nothing (though my employer is paying SOMETHING for it). My concern, however, is that employers will find it simpler to force all of their employers to the plan, meaning that every American is now on one plan.

Is that likely? No. Is it possible? Sure. I'm hoping they will formulate a good plan that gives those without a chance while still letting those who are paying or are subsidized by their employer to get care above and beyond the public plan.

[lafinjack.livejournal.com]

And if you lose your job and can't find another job with similar benefits? Go COBRA? Or what if you want to start your own business?

[donkeyjon.livejournal.com]

The lost job scenario is exactly what COBRA was created for. But yes, I recognize that there are holes in the system. Like I said, I'd MUCH prefer we did a complete overhaul of the insurance system, but the lawmakers don't seem keen on that. :)

[blueduck37.livejournal.com]

The key issue is... what kind of public option?

A serious one? Or one so watered-down it is essentially useless?

[xladymissiex.livejournal.com]

All I want for Christmas is to see the doctor...

I hope we get something soon.

[blueduck37.livejournal.com]

Keep in mind that even if the public option passes, it doesn't go into effect until 2013.

[telemann.livejournal.com]

Aw, is that a proposal you're making? *bats eyes*

[deadpansev.livejournal.com]

Rediclinic's cost $75 a visit, and there are many free or low cost clinics, if you really are so poor that you cannot find $75 somewhere, but really if you cannot save $75 over the course of four months, then you probably qualify for medicaid (and then you will have this great government insurance you are so desperate to get). If you are going to wait for some bureaucrat to address your health issues, then you will have a long wait.

[xladymissiex.livejournal.com]

Well let's see. This is Florida's Medicaid list.

DCF determines Medicaid eligibility for:

* Low income families with children
* Children only
* Pregnant women
* Non-citizens with medical emergencies
* Aged and/or disabled individuals not currently receiving Supplemental Security Income (SSI)
http://www.dcf.state.fl.us/ess/medicaid.shtml

I'm none of those. There is a plan for getting meds for cheap, which I would fall under, but I'd first need to see a doctor to see what's wrong and to continue my Lexapro medication, which I've been holding off for when I get a job so I don't lose it again. There's Blue cross and Blue shield but I'd still need a job to pay for such. I've gone to a clinic for $10 and waited 5 hours but again I need a job.

So pretty much it comes down to whichever happens first, I get a job or we get medical from the government if they allow the unemployed access to it.