(no subject)

[merig00.livejournal.com]

Comments

[garote]

That's a weird one!

[phildegrave]

The deliberate obtuseness displayed aside, is this really what keeps you awake at night?

[merig00.livejournal.com]

Do you charge by the hour?

[phildegrave]

You couldn't afford me.

[merig00.livejournal.com]

That's not very inclusive of you.

[mexpatriot.livejournal.com]

Heh! :)

[yes-justice.livejournal.com]

Mocking trans people is a thing I guess.

[weswilson]

It's funny because people can just say what they want to be, and never have decades of torment trying to find a balance between societal expectations and internal conflict.

[merig00.livejournal.com]

I feel it for the furry community.

[julian-delphik.livejournal.com]

But you clearly don't. I mean look, you're good the way you are--but are you really going to *make fun of a person* because they don't feel comfortable as they are?

There's a documentary out there on Objectivists--people who have romantic relationships with objects. The doc started with a woman who was in love with the Golden Gate Bridge. This woman projected a mental state onto this bridge--others do so with other objects--I don't get it. I'm not them. But making fun of them feels like a low thing to do.

Low blow man, low blow. Comedy is great, but hitting below the belt isn't ok.

Even Cartmen, in south park, tells Butters he'd rather let the Chinese win than stop them by shooting guys in the dick.

[merig00.livejournal.com]

I think it's making fun of the enablers who are demanding we accept any self-identification no matter what it is than actual trans people.

[julian-delphik.livejournal.com]

Have you encountered this in real life, even once?

I think it's a straw-man for you to say this is making fun of some hypothetical enablers. Yes, some 1 person will be like any X you could hypotheticalize up, cause people are weird. But have you ever met that person? Do you find yourself accosted by people on a daily basis insisting that demand you accept Johnny identifies as a firehydrant? Or is that some made-up BS to use to mock trans people?

[merig00.livejournal.com]

That doesn't make sense to me. Have you encountered all the people you've posted cartoons/jokes about in this community?

[julian-delphik.livejournal.com]

Why, I just signed up with this community. I've hardly made jokes about anybody.

My one post is a clip from W-era WH Correspondence Dinner. Bit diff than text over an image that you can craft to make a joke at any group you like.

I just don't think it's funny and I think you are punching down. The "butt" of the joke is "people who use the phrase 'self-identify'" and i just don't see this over-saturation problem, so it feels like you are making fun of the people who use that terminology because it befits them.

[merig00.livejournal.com]

I just wanted to illustrate that you were making faulty argument of "If you are not X you can't talk about things related to X".

Well to each their own. You've asked me how I see the joke. I've explained. Accept or not is up to you. The "butt" of the joke is people who take the phrase "self-identify" seriusly and you demand you take it seriously too. For example I believe Facebook just expanded their gender selection to 56. And NYC laws penalize mis-identification. Same in Canada now.

[julian-delphik.livejournal.com]

No, you are incorrectly characterizing my argument.

And you've just explicitly made my point for me:

"The "butt" of the joke is people who take the phrase "self-identify" seriusly and you demand you take it seriously too"

Yes, when a trans-person says they identify as a X, that is serious and you should treat it seriously. You're kinda a jerk otherwise. Facebook is not serious. But point out the NYC law you have a problem with--be explicit so we can look at the text and not some BS description of it you grabbed from an alt-right website

[merig00.livejournal.com]

Why Facebook thing isn't serious? You haven't memorized all the different genders and pronouns in case you are demanded to use them? :)

Well here's Eugene Volokh at WaPo https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2016/05/17/you-can-be-fined-for-not-calling-people-ze-or-hir-if-thats-the-pronoun-they-demand-that-you-use/?utm_term=.a918f56ec776

[julian-delphik.livejournal.com]

Cause it's fucking facebook.

as for the article:

The NYCHRL [New York City Human Rights Law] requires employers[, landlords, and all businesses and professionals] to use an [employee’s, tenant’s, customer’s, or client’s] preferred name, pronoun and title (e.g., Ms./Mrs.) regardless of the individual’s sex assigned at birth, anatomy, gender, medical history, appearance, or the sex indicated on the individual’s identification.

Examples of Violations

a. Intentional or repeated refusal to use an individual’s preferred name, pronoun or title. For example, repeatedly calling a transgender woman “him” or “Mr.” after she has made clear which pronouns and title she uses


Why would you do that? How is that not gender-harassment? Intentional or repeated ignoring of someone elses wishes--when it costs you nothing. Calling someone a "she" if you think that person is actually a "he"--you can think what you want, but your action of calling them the gender you think they are, that's not ok.

I don't need to memorize gender pronouns--I need to listen to people I interact with, and if they *make clear which pronoun they prefer*, I just use that. I'm asking if you've had problems with people using gender terms you disagree with? I don't encounter an issue with it in real life, it seems like a fake-problem to "make fun of"; it's un-real and really just makes fun of people who use the term seriously.

[merig00.livejournal.com]

Fake problem they make laws about? :) And nice of you just to pick a non-issue part.

And again with the making a joke about something you haven't encountered personally argument. Going in circles. I'm happy to agree to disagree.

[julian-delphik.livejournal.com]

There's a real problem:

People do not respect the rights of Trans individuals.

That's the REAL problem the law is about.

YOU are coming up with a NOT-REAL problem, and "making fun of it"

But since it isn't real, you are actually making fun of the people who deal with it as a REAL problem.

You're happy to agree to disagree, because you are a, if your userpic is you a white guy, and I'm guessing you are straight and CIS. Well good for you; but how about you STOP BEING SUCH A PRICK, prick.

Either you are too dumb to understand what I've said, or you deliberately ignore it so that you can continue to be a negative force in the world that causes injury to those with less power and privilege in society than you.

[dexeron.livejournal.com]

How many of the theoretical people we're discussing end up committing suicide (and being murdered) at a vastly greater rate than the rest of the populace?

[merig00.livejournal.com]

what's wrong with being transpresidential?

[moonshaz.livejournal.com]

Am I the only one who read it as mocking Trump, not trans people?

[julian-delphik.livejournal.com]

eh, it feels like a joke at the expense of trans people. the punchlines are:

stupid women worrying about the glass ceiling

i'm going to misunderstand the criticism behind "not my president" and going to misunderstand the trans/non-CIS statement: "I self identify as a X"

[phildegrave]

Not to mention that the first one is based on a false premise. The whole point is that you don't "pick" your gender - you are born with it.

[julian-delphik.livejournal.com]

Right; this is just another avenue that they can use to justify their harassment.

Same as these fuckers saying that being gay is a "choice"

fuck. that. noise.

[telemann.livejournal.com]

They said it themselves how they read the cartoon "I think it's making fun of the enablers who are demanding we accept any self-identification no matter what it is than actual trans people."

[m1ch43l1c3.livejournal.com]

#alljokesmatter