Religion is a mental illness

[trog.livejournal.com]

Photo: Orthodox Jewish Man Covers Himself In Plastic Bag On Plane

Why is he doing this? Don't read further. I'm telling you, you do not want to know...



We don't often see the classic Twin Peaks phrase "wrapped in plastic" taken so literally—but a Redditor posted the above photo of an Orthodox Jewish man who did just that on a recent flight. Poster "FinalSay" initially assumed the man was covering up because he was in front of women, but others pointed out that it is much more likely that the man is a "Kohen", who are holy priests (or descended from them).

Kohens are prohibited from flying over cemeteries ("A kohen initially was not supposed to approach any dead body, and if he did so he became ritually impure"), which as you can imagine, could be a major problem for travel. According to Haaretz, Rabbi Yosef Shalom Eliashiv, the leader of the Lithuanian Haredi community in Israel, "found a solution to this issue, ruling that wrapping oneself in thick plastic bags while the plane crossed over the cemetery is permissible."



Source: http://gothamist.com/2013/04/11/photo_orthodox_jewish_man_covers_hi.php

Comments

[enders-shadow.livejournal.com]

so he is show-boating, what else is new?

religious people are interested in others seeing just how holy and pious they are. this man is no different.

you familiar with Jon Safron? You seen his exorcism video? Thoughts? (From one critic of religion to another, its a most curious and odd little thing that happens to him)

[wind-shadow2008.livejournal.com]

so he is show-boating, what else is new?

Or, he is following a religious mandate he believes in. How is that showboating?

religious people are interested in others seeing just how holy and pious they are. this man is no different.

Well.....yes, there are many who are like that, unfortunately. I am just not convinced this man is one of them. Obviously, doing something like this will draw attention to himself, but is that really the reason he's doing it?

[enders-shadow.livejournal.com]

Yes, absolutely it is show-boating.

For Cohen's not entering a graveyard is already an increased level of prohibition than is required.

You may not be terribly familiar with Judaism, so, there's a concept they have "building a fence around the torah" now this isn't necessarily literal, but here's the basic idea.

Sleeping with a woman who is not your wife is immoral/sinful.
The odds of sleeping with a woman who is not your wife go down, to almost zero, if you are never alone with a woman who is not your wife. Thus, some Jews, to be EXTRA careful, increase the prohibitions that they themselves follow.

This is called a stringency. For a Cohen, not entering a graveyard is a stringency. This man is doing an increased level of stringency that is not REQUIRED and is absolutely about him being "I'm soooooooo holy"

[wind-shadow2008.livejournal.com]

I am not very well versed with Judaism beyond a very high-level understanding, so thank you. But from OP's original post:

Kohens are prohibited from flying over cemeteries...Rabbi Yosef Shalom Eliashiv, the leader of the Lithuanian Haredi community in Israel, "found a solution to this issue, ruling that wrapping oneself in thick plastic bags while the plane crossed over the cemetery is permissible."

So, doesn't this mean it is required of them (at least assuming they are following this tenet and associated mandate)?

And again, I am sorry if I am missing your point here....I would agree that if it is definitely not required, that there are no religious implications for this person flying over a cemetery, then yes, it is showboating.

[aviv-b.livejournal.com]

That's your interpretation. And while this man is obviously taking this to an extreme, I don't think he's show-boating. There are various Orthodox groups that have different rules from what we know as mainstream Orthodox. How do you know this is not required by his group? Because all the groups you know don't follow this?

[enders-shadow.livejournal.com]

It's not a biblical (OT) requirement.
If his group requires that, they are very much going above and beyond what is required by Jewish law, even for a Cohen.

If it was a common practice, it wouldn't be as noteworthy. It's bouncing around the web because this is an absurd level of "look-at-me! i'm holy!" that plenty, in fact, virtually all of, the other very religious and very strict people do not do.

Not to mention, do we even know if this man is certain that his plane will fly over a graveyard? As I heard it was because he was afraid it might. I don't usually know the precise flight path of my plane....

[aviv-b.livejournal.com]

OH, I agree that he's going way beyond what you or I would normally see as the requirement. But I just don't see it as show-boating - at least not to the world at large. I doubt very much he cares what anyone else thinks, except his Rabbi, of course.
Hey, if he's happy, and he's not bothering anyone, who cares.

[catlin.livejournal.com]

Looking at the map the original piece I saw had, if he was going into Israel it is almost certain that he will fly over one or more cemeteries. The airport is surrounded by them.

[dwer.livejournal.com]

it's bouncing around the web because too many people refuse to follow "judge not, lest ye be judged." I guess you're one of them.

[malasadas.livejournal.com]

His religion gives him a way to deal with ritual impurity that is private and simple.

This action should not logically confer any protection he doesn't have from the plane already unless h is concerned the seat is unclean and even then, a trip to a mikvah will solve it.

[peristaltor.livejournal.com]

Or, he is following a religious mandate he believes in. How is that showboating?

How is it not? Public displays of irrationality one thing; we all indulge in them at some part of our lives. But dogmatic displays of same? That's the very definition of a show-boater. "I am pious! If you do not behave as I, ipso facto you are not!"

The more outlandish the display, the more self-righteous the boater.

[yes-justice.livejournal.com]

you familiar with Jon Safron? You seen his exorcism video? Thoughts? (From one critic of religion to another, its a most curious and odd little thing that happens to him)

Curious and odd? Oh please.

Funny story. A priest in Jr High School claimed to have witness an exorcism, successful, and he told about 30 14 year olds that she floated up to the rafters of the church, lost her demons and fell to her death, but it was okay since she went to heaven. This is exorcism. I got scared figuring they killed the girl.

Its all show biz man.

I'm watching the episode now. So far the exorcist is a total quack.


PT Barnum would be proud. This is a joke:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=Cfphh7R9gH0#t=179s

Nothing "happens" to him other than some of his (and his exorcist) bad acting being filmed.

[enders-shadow.livejournal.com]

You are unfamiiar with Jon Safron then.

I know people who are personally friends of his.
The man was, is, and remains, an ardent and vocal atheist.

There is no reason for Safron to act the way that the religious folks want/expect. He himself was shaken by the event. Still an atheist, but he admits its odd and he doesnt have an explanation.

[yes-justice.livejournal.com]

There is no reason for Safron to act the way that the religious folks want/expect. He himself was shaken by the event. Still an atheist, but he admits its odd and he doesnt have an explanation.

Sounds legit.

[enders-shadow.livejournal.com]

Jus sayin'. If it is what it appears to be, how do we make sense of it? And I won't take "it was an exorcism" as an answer; if I did, I wouldn't be an atheist.

[yes-justice.livejournal.com]

If I am to accept all was as presented, then I would place it somewhere into the spectra of mental illness.

[anfalicious.livejournal.com]

I know people who know him too, the exorcism thing is genuine and it scared the shit out of him.

But notice how he didn't have a demon until the priests start putting him into intense situations. It's simple brainwashing and psychological manipulation, not boogy men.

[enders-shadow.livejournal.com]

And don't get me wrong. I am not saying this as a defense of exorcism or the exorcist. I think that if that man, the one who did the exorcism, met the Dalai Lama, they'd have a most interesting exchange, and clearly, the Dalai Lama is not being possessed by some demon, though the Christian exoricst may think he is.


The only thing about the Safron piece is that it's vastly out of character for Safron. Either we think he is faking it or we don't.

Faking it is the simple answer.

What if he wasn't? Just what if?
Cause from those I know who are his friends, they tell me he wasn't faking. So what then?

[yes-justice.livejournal.com]

Dude. Its a television show. He is acting. He IS faking it. Period. There are NO SUCH THING as demons.

I can offer you footage of foaming schizophrenics which are far more convincing.

[enders-shadow.livejournal.com]

So you are discounting what I know from personal friends of his? I cannot stop you from believing that either:

a) I am lying about knowing a friend of his who says he wasnt faking it
b) his friend lied to me in saying he wasnt faking it
c) Safron lied to his friend about not faking it

But, me being who I am (an atheist, mind you) I do not think any of those things. I would certainly think things simpler, if those were the case. Since I do not believe those, I too am confused.

Let me ask you this: ever witness a really bad trip?

[yes-justice.livejournal.com]

I have no reason to discount the personal comments other than their content, but yes, I will discount the inherent assertion that their are demons and I will 100% discount the existence of "possession".

a) I am lying about knowing a friend of his who says he wasnt faking it
b) his friend lied to me in saying he wasnt faking it
c) Safron lied to his friend about not faking it


All are irrelevant to me, and I didn't doubt you were telling the truth, my issue is that demons don't exist and possession isn't real.

Yeah, witnessed some bad trips. That's different from possession.

[anfalicious.livejournal.com]

If you watch the whole series, it would be really out of context for him to fake this and would actually harm his overall narrative. It's amazing what you can make the human mind do when you deprive of sleep, food, water and then put it in stressful situations.

[yes-justice.livejournal.com]

Sorry. Not buying it.

[yes-justice.livejournal.com]

think that if that man, the one who did the exorcism, met the Dalai Lama, they'd have a most interesting exchange

Well, that's only because the current Dali Lama is most wise. That other dude is deluded at best or a charlatan at worst.

By the way, don't get me wrong, I'm only taking issue with that agnosticism pertaining to the exorcism. The other stuff you offered about the Cohen's was informative and most appreciated.

[anfalicious.livejournal.com]

John Saffran is awesome :)