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Date: 2010-09-14 12:15 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] pacotelic.livejournal.com
Pretty much.

I know plenty of Christians who are good and decent people. The religious right is not these people, down to the brokest, bitterest footsoldier.

If we condemn Islam for not repudiating the terrorists claiming it as their religion, we can also condemn Xtianity for not casting out these vengeful pharisees.

Date: 2010-09-14 12:23 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sammygoliath.livejournal.com
I think that anybody arguing for greater understanding and tolerance of Islam should also try to understand that there are many different branches of Christianity, and almost all are tolerant, inviting, and forgiving. It's the same argument, and it deserves to be said.

Also, I've heard the argument presented in the second panel, and it is the most illogical, infuriating, and ridiculous argument available today.

Date: 2010-09-14 12:28 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sammygoliath.livejournal.com
I don't understand why you are comparing terrorists with book burners.

The nation has very soundly condemned the book burners.

It is unnecessary to condemn all Christians in general for a completely over-reported incident which has nothing to do with them.

Date: 2010-09-14 12:38 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] the-rukh.livejournal.com
It is unnecessary to condemn all Muslims in general for a completely over-reported incident which has nothing to do with them.


In general, people know that you shouldn't condemn all of Christianity for a few fruitloops, but they're making a point by saying it that you should think of Islam similarly.

Date: 2010-09-14 12:56 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] squidb0i.livejournal.com
Show us where all Christians are being condemned.

Date: 2010-09-14 01:01 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sammygoliath.livejournal.com
Who is "they"?

The New Golden Rule:

Do unto all Christianity what a few nutty pastors would have done against Muslims.

Date: 2010-09-14 01:06 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sammygoliath.livejournal.com
The previous commenter was saying that condemnation of general "Xtianity" is somehow deserved if Islamic communities fail to condemn terrorists. I think that's apples and oranges.

But to answer your question, Christians are not being condemned. They are subject to ridicule and heckled anonymously, (flying spaghetti monster is my very favorite and delicious example... I was touched many years ago...) but so is everybody and that's fair and they can take it.

Date: 2010-09-14 01:12 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sammygoliath.livejournal.com
As a curious atheist I invite you to explain to me how.

Date: 2010-09-14 01:18 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sammygoliath.livejournal.com
To make it easier, Could you please use this list: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christian_denominations_by_number_of_members to point to me which denominations are intolerant, uninviting, or unforgiving?

Date: 2010-09-14 01:40 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sammygoliath.livejournal.com
1) Roman Catholics invite everybody to their masses. If they think the other sects should convert, well, that's pretty inviting to. They have internal problems, but being uninviting or intolerant or unforgiving doesn't seem to be among them.

2) Protestants seem to be less centrally organized, and their churches probably vary a great deal, but I've never heard of them turning people away or being intolerant to new religions.

3) Jehovah's Witnesses are unforgiving, it's true, but they are so goddamn inviting at 6 on a Sunday, so maybe it evens out?

As for the other ones, those can be scary. Small percentage of the whole population though.

Date: 2010-09-14 02:05 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] the-rukh.livejournal.com
You didn't listen to a word I said did you.

Date: 2010-09-14 02:12 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sammygoliath.livejournal.com
If Terry Jones and a sizable church of dedicated followers were on a mission to destroy every Qur'an in the world it would be a valid comparison, but even his own church condemns him.

Date: 2010-09-14 02:33 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] pacotelic.livejournal.com
Of course we're ridiculing right wing whackjob Taliban Christian soldiers.

What I'm asking for is even a little effort on the part of mainstream Christians to repudiate the radical extremists from their ranks. I see no sign of this, so I get to tar all Christians as an inherently violent, intolerant religion that we'd all be better off without.

Its only what we're asking of Islam, right?

Date: 2010-09-14 02:36 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] pacotelic.livejournal.com
Of course they inviting people to their masses. They're all trying to Sell you something. They'd be idiots to not try to recruit for their softball team.

Besides, the Mormons got it right. I believe South Park on all things like a good ironic skeptic internet jockey.

Date: 2010-09-14 02:58 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sammygoliath.livejournal.com
Don't buy then. I didn't either.

Date: 2010-09-14 03:10 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sammygoliath.livejournal.com
You want mainstream christians? I'll give you the vatican:
http://www.myfoxny.com/dpp/news/national/vatican-says-koran-buring-would-be-outrageous-newscore-20100908

Or if you like, evangelicals, like Terry says he is:
http://www.worldevangelicals.org/news/article.htm?id=3074&cat=main

Later Day Saints:
http://newsroom.lds.org/ldsnewsroom/eng/news-releases-stories/church-statement-on-the-burning-of-the-koran

do you need more links or is that enough?

Date: 2010-09-14 03:16 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] the-rukh.livejournal.com
Quote: myself: In general, people know that you shouldn't condemn all of Christianity for a few fruitloops, but they're making a point by saying it that you should think of Islam similarly.

Date: 2010-09-14 03:16 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sammygoliath.livejournal.com
But since I gave it to you, you should give it to me. Did violence occur due to Terry Jones' ridiculous publicity stunt? Yep. Did it happen in the US? ummm... please show me.

Date: 2010-09-14 03:19 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sammygoliath.livejournal.com
I'm sorry, I wasn't clear in my last comment.

I disagree because I don't think that the comparison of Terry and Christianity to terrorists and Islam is fair due to the vast difference in magnitude.

Date: 2010-09-14 03:21 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] pacotelic.livejournal.com
Not the game I'm playing. Is Islam the religion ny more inherently violent than Judaism, Christianity of Hinduism?
From: [identity profile] squidb0i.livejournal.com
"If we condemn Islam for not repudiating the terrorists claiming it as their religion, we can also condemn Xtianity for not casting out these vengeful pharisees."

S/he's calling the mainstream of both religions out on failing to expunge their respective weaponized-versions by drawing a comparison between the two.

Date: 2010-09-14 03:39 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sammygoliath.livejournal.com
In the past ten years, which of the three religions you mentioned killed the most people for religious reasons?

Date: 2010-09-14 03:40 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] squidb0i.livejournal.com
lol, i just noticed that you underlined the P.


'XD

Date: 2010-09-14 03:50 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] the-rukh.livejournal.com
Ok, use the abortion bombers, or the Lords Resistance Army terrorists, or the crusaders, or the inquisition, or whatever you think would be similar, I don't care and it doesn't matter.

Date: 2010-09-14 03:50 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] the-rukh.livejournal.com
None of the religions have killed anyone.
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