Unclear News

[pigshitpoet.livejournal.com]

Japan at Nature's Edge: The Nuclear Context of an Unclear Power

You know that smell in the air, where everyone says, "Whodunnit?" but nobody will own up to it. Well it seems Japan is in denial about Unclear waste from Nuclear power... and now America has signs of the disease. - Peter Barakan (journalist at large)



If it smells like shit and it looks like shit, it probably is shit. Much like projectile vomit, in most average shit cases, verbal diarrhoea comes flying out of one's ass at 5000 miles per hour and rips off your ass cheeks, therefore leaving you assless for the rest of your life, unless the Big Pharma ass fairy plastic surgeon comes in and creates new ass cheeks for you out of chicken fat. Coprophilia (also known as coprolagnia) is a paraphilia where people get sexual pleasure from faeces. Sexual excitement typically comes from either (i) watching somebody defecate on somebody else (as is the case between right and left politics) or (ii) they themselves defecating on somebody else (which has somehow become a daily American media practice). In rare instances, some people may become sexually aroused when they are defecated upon by somebody else. The American Psychiatric Association’s Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM-IV) believes this disorder has now spread to America from ocean bound Nuclear waste in the Pacific reaching the shores of California, resulting in the 2016 US election and ensuing faecal matters in the form of "the Donald" a giant turd, creating a big stink in the land.



Inspiration Street : Streetsmart Street Art "Dump Trump" Trump Dump Corpora-phelia (fear of corporate reprisal)

However, Japan is way ahead of the curve in recently producing digestible waste from its own human faeces. Apparently it sort of tastes like chicken!

This message has been sponsored by American Gubernational

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Comments

[donkeyjon.livejournal.com]

I'm torn on Japan right now. On the one hand, nuclear power is considerably safer and more ecologically viable than coal or oil, and the amazingly low death toll from Fukushima (which was a terrible design in a terrible location) was incredibly low. On the other hand, TEPCO is obviously manned entirely by malicious idiots who'd rather let a problem becomes a disaster than admit that they made mistakes.

In short, nuclear power isn't a problem, but if your country can't run their nuclear plants properly, maybe you shouldn't have nuclear power...

[pigshitpoet.livejournal.com]

the scientifically unreported short term low death toll, but who knows what effect it actually has on the environment, oceans and other countries in the long run

homer simpson works at TEPCO

[donkeyjon.livejournal.com]

We already know the effect on the oceans and other countries. Nothing. The radiation levels are negligible outside of Japan.

[pigshitpoet.livejournal.com]

not true. it's blocked from MSM. it's tainting salmon up the coast in bc

there's a food warning for anyone who's interested..

saturday night fish fry

[donkeyjon.livejournal.com]

Have you got a link with the details? I've fond nothing.

[pigshitpoet.livejournal.com]

this is the one that struck me the most. Dr Helen Caldicott - Fukushima Nuclear Disaster- You won't hear this on the Main Stream News

https://youtu.be/4ITrXVJMKeQ

it's still a big question that isn't being discussed openly. here's some links, interestingly there is reneging on their initial claims happening. in canada it goes back to when harper was premier and blocking scientific data to force through the tar sands oil project after he fired a thousand federal environmental scientists to hush them on the subjects. it hasn't changed much with trudeau either. governments are skewing the data in favour of jobs and corporate profits. there was a lot of hype against all corporate negligence to gain public sympathy since 911, so the journalists aren't getting the data clearly and the issue is complicated by the complex variations needed in transparent public studies. it's a fucking fish breakfast. google also blocks and redirects a lot of search traffic on the subjects paid for by big brother and pundits

http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2014/01/22/national/barakan-says-broadcasters-told-him-to-avoid-nuclear-issues-till-after-poll/#.WLzElxiZNE4

http://news.nationalpost.com/news/canada/david-suzuki-regrets-claim-that-another-fukushima-disaster-would-require-mass-evacuations-in-north-america

there were also debates on how much and what kind of radiation is safe

http://www.macleans.ca/news/canada/the-real-fallout-from-fukushima/

much of the cautionary thinking comes from natural health people mike adams and democracy now amy goodman

http://www.naturalnews.com/2017-02-06-unimaginable-radiation-levels-detected-at-fukushima-mox-fuel-melts-through-reactor-floor.html

http://www.naturalnews.com/052754_Aloe_vera_Fukushima_radiation_California_government.html

harper's war on science for corporate profits

http://www.nationalobserver.com/2015/07/20/opinion/another-federal-scientist-fired-harpers-ongoing-war-science

[donkeyjon.livejournal.com]

Unfortunately, the sources you have chosen are suspect. But thank you for giving me some things to read about this. You haven't changed my mind, but you've given me some more information, and that's always a plus.

Helen Caldicott in particular has been perfectly willing to lie and fear-monger in the past. She, for instance, has claimed that 80% of the babies born in Iraq have defects, which is a straight-up lie. She wants to end nuclear power forever, and believes that lies and misinformation are justified if it leads to the end of nuclear weapons (her own words).

That having been said, I am glad to read the claims to get a feel for what people think about the issue.

[pigshitpoet.livejournal.com]

i always wondered about caldicott. what's your take on this guy? dr. michio kaku water intelligence scientist, even his name sounds fukushimish..

https://youtu.be/Rrxmy6R3m90

today what isn't suspect? and if we can't believe MSM who can we believe?

in any case, we don't seem to be getting clear information from legitimate authorities, probably because they don't know themselves what will happen

truly, i don't know what to think. i feel like neville shute on the beach in the land down under waiting for the radiation cloud to hit australia..

[donkeyjon.livejournal.com]

Michio Kaku is actually a pretty well-respected physicist. So this is a lot more reputable. Though it does come from several years ago (March 2011), and the points he's making are essentially "This could be very bad if something more happens before cold shutdown". Well, they are now in full cold shutdown, so those concerns aren't a problem.

He does, however, point out how shitty TEPCO was on disseminating info, and how much misinformation they were spreading. THIS is a huge concern, as I mentioned above. TEPCO is likely not a company that should have nuclear plants.

To give you some idea of the levels we're talking about, here are the reports of radiation they've found on the west coast of North America:
http://www.statesmanjournal.com/story/tech/science/environment/2016/12/07/fukushima-radiation-has-reached-us-shores/95045692/ (http://www.statesmanjournal.com/story/tech/science/environment/2016/12/07/fukushima-radiation-has-reached-us-shores/95045692/)
They have found levels of cesium-134, but they are still considerably lower than any level that we would be concerned about. A quote from below sums it up:
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2016/12/09/should-we-worried-fukushima-radiation/95196156/ (http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2016/12/09/should-we-worried-fukushima-radiation/95196156/)
"To put it in context, if you were to swim everyday for six hours a day in those waters for a year, that additional radiation from the addressed cesium from Japan ... is 1000 times smaller than one dental x-ray," Buesseler said in a phone interview.

It is important to note that the meltdown had 4 victims, if I remember, due to chemical burns of staff while trying to fix the problem at the time. The staff who were on site at the time and who will be involved in the cleanup will have slightly elevated chances of cancer, but their survival rate is actually higher than the general population because they will receive regular checks for the rest of their lives. So, they will likely live longer than they would have before the accident. Unfortunately, due to the evacuation, most of which was unnecessary and driven by fear, at least 1500 people have died (mostly the old and very ill, who were forced to moved out of hospitals).

So, the current score is: Plant Disaster: 4 Fear and Misunderstanding: 1500

[pigshitpoet.livejournal.com]

thanks for your clarity and information. i just started out making fun of a disaster that i have little control over and feel a lot of anxiety about, and learned something in the process! thanks for the updates man!

you are a good sot.

peace and understanding
; )

[yes-justice.livejournal.com]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/robots-fukushima-nuclear-disaster-dying-probe-clean-up-tepco-toshiba-reactor-nuclear-radiation-a7612396.html

"The robot was supposed to be able to cope with 73 sieverts of radiation, but the radiation level inside the reactor was recently recorded at 530 sieverts."

That is roughly 50 times a lethal dose.

[donkeyjon.livejournal.com]

Yes. Inside the reactor vessel. It's going to absolutely suck to do the cleanup. That's what happens inside the reactor.

[pigshitpoet.livejournal.com]

you would think that we would have found a way to atomically implode the matter or anti-matter to completely eliminate the radioactive toxins. there must be something to counter nuclear waste.. rock paper scissors!

[yes-justice.livejournal.com]

"It's going to absolutely suck to do the cleanup"

No one knows HOW to clean it up. And that is a problem for the long term sustainability of nuclear.

[pigshitpoet.livejournal.com]

i can't conceive of how anyone, robot or human can do a safe cleanup..

it's sci-fi scary

[pigshitpoet.livejournal.com]

holy shite! really?

now there's a good idea for a ski fi movie - dead robots!

i like that

and it's going to take atomic fallout to kill them

but hey, it's worth it to save the planet

i'm starting to write the script as we speak

brilliant!

[yes-justice.livejournal.com]

"most of which was unnecessary and driven by fear,"

Listen to you. They found plenty of hot spots in the evac zone and cleaned them up, and had people not be evac'd, that would have hurt people. They were also evac'ing for worst case scenarios which for some reason very smart people thought were close enough to possible to risk the evac. And, oh yeah, there was that Tsunami they were digging out from while all this was going down.

Don't see how anyone can wag the finger at Tepco and the evac unless you can specifically say how it could have handled it better.

[yes-justice.livejournal.com]

Before this, Japan's nuke program was hailed a success story for the nuke industry worldwide and for the government of Japan. It was promoted as futuristic and environmental. The Japanese people were assured a Chernobyl could never happen and they would have clean, safe, cheap, environmental power.

Now there isn't a robot on the planet that can get close to it and it will kill any man merely too close instantly.

Could the nuclear industry just clean up their own fucking dirty room before they go out an brag more?

[donkeyjon.livejournal.com]

You keep citing the conditions inside the reactor. The inside of a reactor after a meltdown is very bad. And cleaning it up will take many, many years. If your problem with nuclear power is that the inside of the reactors is a really bad place, then sure.

But that's like saying that steel mills are terrible because the inside of the blast furnace is deadly to humans.

If your issue is that nuclear plants are deadly inside for decades afterward, then yes. That is true. And they're still better for the environment than coal or oil burning power plants. And they kill significantly less people.

[pigshitpoet.livejournal.com]

thanks

yes, i hear you. one needs to discern where the pollution ends up affecting. the environmental issue was from dumping waste into the ocean to prevent the reactors from melting down. that's how it ended up in the ocean from leakage for prevention. so yes the mess is in the core. the trick is to keep it contained, which seems near impossible at some point as things escalate. after fukushima germany closed a good number of old nuclear plants maybe realizing that if this occurred it wouldn't be safe? or what i don't know. public pressure? hmmm...

[yes-justice.livejournal.com]

But that's like saying that steel mills are terrible because the inside of the blast furnace is deadly to humans.

We cannot even turn off the blast furnace. And its leaking into the stream.

If your issue is that nuclear plants are deadly inside for decades afterward, then yes. That is true. And they're still better for the environment than

Can you stop stay better and start saying different? Been brown so long it looks like green to me. And I guarantee you that the C02 and other gg output of building and maintaining a plant (you have to mine the raw materials for example) is consistently poorly and under estimated. And that coastline area where the plant lives is fucking (or rather was fucking) beautiful. No one can go there anymore. I know, not your home, but sheet man.

they kill significantly less people.

At our current scale. By why fuck around with that when we have a nuclear furnace in space that produces 1400 watts per square meter? We just need to improve efficiency.

[pigshitpoet.livejournal.com]

nuclear furnace in space. better get that checked annually for fuel leaks..

i never heard of a nuclear furnace in space. where in space? you mean the sun?

[yes-justice.livejournal.com]

Yes, el Sol.

[pigshitpoet.livejournal.com]

so the safest place at the moment is pluto..

; ))

[donkeyjon.livejournal.com]

I'm certain that we both agree that the end goal is to go completely with clean, renewable energy sources. The problem is Japan is a long way from that right now. Their current goal is to be up to 24% renewable energy by 2030. So, what's the end result of NOT using nuclear power in Japan? Coal or oil. Which both kill more people than nuclear.

If your argument is "nuclear power has serious problems compared to renewable energy," I agree. We need to be working full-bore on getting everyone transferred to a renewable grid. But if your argument is "We shouldn't use nuclear because it is dangerous," then you can't logically fall back on coal and oil. We need to use nuclear power as a bridge until we an go full renewable.

[donkeyjon.livejournal.com]

Also:

And that coastline area where the plant lives is fucking (or rather was fucking) beautiful. No one can go there anymore. I know, not your home, but sheet man.

Completely incorrect. You could swim in the ocean off of Fukushima right now, and the chances of you dying due to drowning are higher than the chances of you dying from cancer due to the radiation. That coastline is fine. But we're all crazy with fear and so the government keeps people out of there and drums up further fear.

[yes-justice.livejournal.com]

So here is where I ask for your credentials as you seem to wave away other credentialed officials as fear mongers.

[pigshitpoet.livejournal.com]

short version, badges? we don't need no stinking badges, just to have an opinion..

the system is broken. it's a mess.

i'm more from the detective side that works with a hunch and gut feeling.

" believe no one, suspect everything " - inspector jacques clousseau of the sortie )))

sorry, i grew up on pink panther, not the news hour

; )

[donkeyjon.livejournal.com]

Don't take my word for it. But, for instance, Ken Buesseler at WHOI is an expert in this area who is certainly NOT pro-nuclear power:

http://www.whoi.edu/page.do?pid=127297 (http://www.whoi.edu/page.do?pid=127297)

About halfway down:

Is radiation exposure from the ocean and beach a concern?
I stood on the deck of a ship l2 miles from the Fukushima reactors in June 2011 and was about one-half mile away as recently as October 2015 and the radiation detectors I was carrying showed little or no increase above background levels. Even the samples I collected (water, sediment, plants, and animals) from these locations are safe to handle without any precautions. In fact, our biggest problem is blocking interference from background radiation in our samples so we can isolate the trace levels of cesium and other radionuclides that we know came from Fukushima.

On the West Coast of North America, radiation from the water, sediment, and biota is even less of a problem because of the distance from Japan and the dilution that occurs as the contaminants cross the Pacific. The greatest concern is for those who work on the site of the reactors because leaks from storage tanks could release water with high concentrations of contaminants.

Now, there is concern because radiation in food is an entirely different matter, so fishing off the coast of Japan is rightly being curtailed until we have more information on how much radiation is in the fish. But the ocean itself, right now, is basically back to background levels. That's not to say there can't be another massive release of material in the future, but right now it's fine.

[pigshitpoet.livejournal.com]

thanks for the information. my original point is the mainstream is paid what not to tell the public.

i'm happy that some people are trying to study it.

so what does he actually do with this expertise, other than to paint a picture of safety, more or less.. so he collects samples from elsewhere, and then does what? what can he do about this if anything? not all living things are impervious to prolonged low levels. has he tested long low level exposure in his research? the first focus is always high incident exposure of course, but living organisms don't understand human political posturing. they take the full hit.

so, science observations are not factual either, too many variables, it's conjecture about what he thinks he knows. tell him to put on a radiation suit and go into the core to stop the leak or even prevent another. then tell us how that feels.

i don't get what purpose that serves after the fact. it's like hiroshima-nagasaki when the bombs were dropped. did that help the people who were exposed to the blast? based on that science, did the mainstream report on it back then or simply iron over it? that was my original point - is the mainstream simply paid what 'not' to tell the public? the science will no doubt continue. but the truth will look like a pile of melted reactor core.

living in mired times
; '

[pigshitpoet.livejournal.com]

it's all so sad to me that we have even chosen to live like this

what you suggest, that would be like asking psychopathic vampires to act human..

not sure if that's even possible

nuclear vampires, like nuclear empire, like i'm going to smote them.. god loves sodom and sodom loves gomorra

; )))

[donkeyjon.livejournal.com]

The hot spots in the evac zone, even those right next to the plant in the path of the airborne radioactive material, was enough to give someone a slightly higher risk of thyroid cancer. Keep in mind that we have solid data from Chernobyl, where considerably more radiation was released to the surrounding area, and the results there, after decades, are an increase in thyroid cancer rates from 0.7 per 100,000 to 11 per 100,000. They estimate that there has been about 4000 extra cases of thyroid cancer due to Chernobyl, and 9 deaths due to it. This is because the people in the affected area are screened carefully and often to catch it early. And that was with orders of magnitude MORE radiation released.

Now, in comparison, we KNOW that at least 1500 people have died because of the evacuation for Fukushima. So, we killed 1500 people to prevent something like 10 deaths from cancer 15 years later. That's a problem.

The issue is that people don't understand radiation. They fear it and take extreme action when doing so is worse than the alternative.

[pigshitpoet.livejournal.com]

you seem like you follow science closely. i admire that. poets rarely pay attention to fact. sorry, that's my achilles heel..

anyway, have you seen a documentary outlining how humans face extreme condition to survive in desolate and toxic environments, for instance there were a group of people who mined sulphur from toxic pools wearing nothing by cloth scarves over their face to block the fumes. some of them died from it, but they still keep doing it because that's the default environment..

amazing

[yes-justice.livejournal.com]

People don't understand radiation, `tis true. We can measure very tiny amounts of it, and we hate dying of cancer. You also are projecting numbers from a limited perception, but hey, no other choice, but they are likely to be flawed numbers.

Another issue is that people don't understand C02 and how it behaves with light.

Anyway, clean your room if you want my support.

[pigshitpoet.livejournal.com]

yes cleaning our room is the first step to environmental change..

i love it!

i cleaned my room..

; )

[yes-justice.livejournal.com]

Did you clean up the radioactive boars?

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/09/world/asia/radioactive-boars-in-fukushima-thwart-residents-plans-to-return-home.html

[pigshitpoet.livejournal.com]

not the boars but my sock were pretty smelly

radioactive boars. it makes my heart sink to think we caused the creatures of nature to suffer from this, as a species we seem pretty egocentric.

imagine being a duck migrating and landing in an oil spill in the gulf of mexico, plastered in muck.

saved by caring humans from other stupid humans

[pigshitpoet.livejournal.com]

how do they clean up radiation? it's not like oil spills is it?

[telemann.livejournal.com]

Dr. Michio Kaku is great. Not sure what a "fukushimish" name sounds like though.

[pigshitpoet.livejournal.com]

like yo-yo-ma playing the bass cello))

[yes-justice.livejournal.com]

We don't know how to clean up Fukushima, so we sure as shit don't get to say nuclear power is not a problem. Until it the disaster, nuke folks were citing it as a success story. Now its frying any bot we send looking for the melted core, which we cannot find. TEPCO is one of the better companies worldwide, and if you can do better at containing that mess, suit the hell up and go fucking do it because its a epic disaster and they needed your help last year.

And Mt Diablo in California could have been Fuk'd pretty easily.

[donkeyjon.livejournal.com]

The NAIIC was very clear. TEPCO skipped safety procedures, and refused to upgrade their equipment because they feared it would lead to protests from the public. TEPCO wanted to pull all staff from the plant when the disaster began because they felt that the bad press would hurt them more if they tried to stop the coming meltdown than if they just evacuated and let it happen. TEPCO lied about the severity of the damage and the problems with their own chain of command during the cleanup.

So, what we have is a company that is willing to do things the wrong way, and willing to lie and put people in danger to make themselves look good. They shouldn't be running nuclear plants.

[pigshitpoet.livejournal.com]

i think most of capitalism operates that way. minimize expenses maximize profits, damn the safety.

[yes-justice.livejournal.com]

You are making my case for me. This is the same TEPCO that was hailed as a success story to every Japanese person for a generation from every nuclear proponent before the accident. And guess what, that kind of incompetence, willful and otherwise, is what we have to work with in every country, in every situation. No humans on the planet are immune to that stuff.

Bottom line. The room is messy. Pro nuke folks need to clean the room. Its not much to ask.

[donkeyjon.livejournal.com]

See my above comment. I agree, but the room is considerably cleaner already than the viable alternatives for the next 20 years.