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[farchivist.livejournal.com]

Comments

[badlydrawnjeff.livejournal.com]

I don't see how the link you're providing says a thing about taxation being a form of debt.

To put it another way, the government has no idea what I'll make next week, never mind next year. How is it a debt?

[madscience.livejournal.com]

So argument #2? Just want to be clear here.

[badlydrawnjeff.livejournal.com]

It's your entire idea that a tax liability is equal to a debt.

[madscience.livejournal.com]

It'd be pretty damn hard to argue that tax liability isn't a debt. But I'll be gracious and assume you hastily misspoke.

My argument breaks down as follows:

1) Economic principles, not the whims of lawmakers, dictate good tax policy.
2) Good tax policy describes actual taxpayer debt to society.
3) A tax policy that assesses lower taxes than good tax policy forgives actual taxpayer debt.
4) Forgiveness of debt is an expense.

So, which of those points do you disagree with?

[badlydrawnjeff.livejournal.com]

It'd be pretty damn hard to argue that tax liability isn't a debt. But I'll be gracious and assume you hastily misspoke.

No, I didn't misspeak. I don't see how it's a debt. You owe tax for future activity, not for something that's already happened. You do not owe a dollar amount for an upcoming year, but an arbitrary amount based on any number of factors that may not apply from year to year. To treat tax reduction as a debt cancellation makes no sense unless you're actively crediting previously-paid taxes.

So, which of those points do you disagree with?

2 through 4, as it positions taxation as a debt. #3 in particular is problematic, since I'm unaware of any tax policy that acts in that manner. Maybe tax rebates like the stimulus checks early on or what Minnesota did?

[madscience.livejournal.com]

"You owe tax for future activity, not for something that's already happened."

This is the first time I've ever thought you might be trolling instead of just wrong. You produce some amazing gems when you're cornered, Jeff.

[badlydrawnjeff.livejournal.com]

I don't see how I'm trolling you or how you've cornered me. I've not once seen taxation considered a debt, more a societal obligation. Thus, when tax rates are lowered, you're not seeing your debt "forgiven" as you're putting it. It's an absurd position to take.

[madscience.livejournal.com]

Hey, maybe I'll try that logic on the IRS next year. "I don't view this so much as a debt..."

[madscience.livejournal.com]

And I'd say you're pretty much cornered, if you're defending yourself with statements as patently stupid as, "You owe tax for future activity, not for something that's already happened." Have you ever filed your own taxes, or do you just have servants prepare them for you?

[badlydrawnjeff.livejournal.com]

I file my own taxes, thanks. It's revenues to pay for upcoming expenditures, of course.

You can say I'm "cornered," but you've not refuted a single thing I've said up to this point, so...

[madscience.livejournal.com]

"It's revenues to pay for upcoming expenditures, of course."

Nice try, but I'm not going to let you subtly change the subject and pretend that's what we were talking about the whole time. Face it, you're cornered... again.

[badlydrawnjeff.livejournal.com]

Sorry, I don't see how I'm cornered. You're the one who threw the curveball with the whole "debt" nonsense.

[madscience.livejournal.com]

It wasn't a "curveball"; I explained it in detail. And then you began to squirm.

[badlydrawnjeff.livejournal.com]

Whatever you say.