Date: 2009-01-09 07:24 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ellie-kay.livejournal.com
very stimulating!!!!

Date: 2009-01-10 06:20 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] squidb0i.livejournal.com
Sure, if by stimulating you mean masturbatory.

Date: 2009-01-10 06:28 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ellie-kay.livejournal.com
genitally stimulating. mmmmm

Date: 2009-01-10 07:15 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] reality-hammer.livejournal.com
I think you overloaded his systems. :D

Date: 2009-01-10 07:18 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ellie-kay.livejournal.com
should i say the work *spunk*??? haha!

Date: 2009-01-09 07:28 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] lafinjack.livejournal.com
Different from regular companies... how?

Date: 2009-01-09 09:03 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] coolstring.livejournal.com
Don't know what government you've worked for, but I know plenty of people who have been fired from US and State government jobs.

Date: 2009-01-10 07:16 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] reality-hammer.livejournal.com
When you see stories of 911 operators who hung up on people being raped/killed who were then "reassigned" or left on the job it's hard to believe anything short of mass murder will get a government employee fired.

Just look at Blago! :D

Date: 2009-01-10 08:32 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] xforge.livejournal.com
People elected to office, including Marion Berry and Gov. Bighair =/= bureaucratic pencil-pushers.

Date: 2009-01-11 12:49 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] coolstring.livejournal.com
You do realize that the government's a tiny bit larger than the 911 operators and Blago, right? Just because someone did a bad job in one tiny sector of one part of the government in one city doesn't mean that the whole system sucks and that no one is ever fired for misconduct.

Date: 2009-01-09 09:32 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] terminator44.livejournal.com
More to the point, private enterprises operating in a free-market environment are more likely to fire lazy/incompetent employees than governments are for two main reasons:

1:Businesses have to remain profitable to stay in business, unlike today's government, where a deficit in the trillions doesn't seem to be a big deal.

2: If customers are dissatisfied with the poor service of one business, they can usually go to another. If citizens are upset with the policies of their government it is usually very difficult (and dangerous in certain countries) to move to another and start over as a citizen of another nation. Even if moving was easy it would not necessarily cause governments to provide better services, as nations don't compete for taxpayers in the sense that businesses compete for customers.

Both of these reasons may help explain why private companies almost always perform better than government agencies (Ex. FedEx vs. USPS).

Date: 2009-01-10 01:10 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] telemann.livejournal.com
More to the point, private enterprises operating in a free-market environment are more likely to fire lazy/incompetent employees than goverments.

Well unless you're a CEO that drove the company into the ground and get a multi-million retirement package including bonus money.

Date: 2009-01-10 02:51 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fleaplus.livejournal.com
> Well unless you're a CEO that drove the company into the ground and get a multi-million retirement package including bonus money.

Nice snark, but what's the total sum of those kind of golden parachutes for failed companies annually? I'd wager it's quite a few order of magnitudes less than money that goes to lazy/incompetent government employees.

Date: 2009-01-10 02:53 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] telemann.livejournal.com
And you'd wager a losing bet.

Date: 2009-01-10 03:22 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fleaplus.livejournal.com
I sincerely doubt that the annual value of golden parachutes for CEOs of failed companies is more than a few billion.

Date: 2009-01-10 03:28 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] telemann.livejournal.com
Let me put this entire thread to rest-- the case for making govt work like a private business is a bullshit one for a whole variety of reasons that are too lengthy to get into here. The entire argument is also bullshit because it assumes private businesses make no mistakes, only have the best intentions in mind and don't ever have bad and lazy workers or make poor decisions. I grew up in a heavily military area (Norfolk, Virginia) and have worked at the world's largest private shipyard. I've also known many govt workers who are extremely hard working, and are in fact some of the most patriotic people I know. You'd be shocked to know the majority of them were typically Republican/conservative leaning.

Edited Date: 2009-01-10 03:29 am (UTC)

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] terminator44.livejournal.com - Date: 2009-01-10 05:56 am (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] telemann.livejournal.com - Date: 2009-01-10 06:31 am (UTC) - Expand
(deleted comment)

Date: 2009-01-11 12:20 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] desidono.livejournal.com
This.

The USPS provides competitive and efficient direct front door delivery service six days a week, even to areas that are too small or remote to be profitable by a private company. Pretty awesome actually.

Aaah, selective memory.

Date: 2009-01-10 06:23 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] squidb0i.livejournal.com
Oh, so all those companies that dug themselves and us - YOU- a nice deep economic pit by exploiting technically legal but abysmally stupid business practices like basing complex financial derivatives on non-transparent high risk faux-assets like subprime mortgages handed out without documentation.. those don't count suddenly?

Sweeet!

Does that mean we get the BAILOUT money back?
Now if only Paulson could remember where it all went.



Re: Aaah, selective memory.

Date: 2009-01-11 05:33 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] terminator44.livejournal.com
Oh, so all those companies that dug themselves and us - YOU- a nice deep economic pit by exploiting technically legal but abysmally stupid business practices like basing complex financial derivatives on non-transparent high risk faux-assets like sub prime mortgages handed out without documentation.. those don't count suddenly?

This statement, while true, only tells half of the story. Until recently, sub prime mortgages were viewed as profitable and sustainable. This fact begs the question: why? Mainly due to rising housing prices, which were brought on by the Federal Reserve. Over the past eight years they lowered the Federal funds rate and its interest rates, practically flooding the market with credit to perpetuate the housing bubble and make sub prime mortgages more profitable. Nobody in the federal government's vast bueraucracy saw this as a problem. In fact, Housing and Urban Development encouraged (http://pubcit.typepad.com/clpblog/2008/09/blaming-the-cra.html) Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to use sub prime loans to provide affordable housing for low-income families.

As I've said before, the sub prime crisis was not proof of the superiority of government over business in resolving basic economic questions. It was a disaster brought on by systematic problems in both, problems that cannot be solved by more money and more employees (again, we need to bear in mind the message of the cartoon posted).

Does that mean we get the BAILOUT money back?
Unfortunately, no, because we never had that money in the first place. The government just told us we did ;).

Re: Aaah, selective memory.

Date: 2009-01-11 09:49 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] squidb0i.livejournal.com
True true true and true.

What were we arguing about again?

Re: Aaah, selective memory.

Date: 2009-01-11 03:20 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] terminator44.livejournal.com
I don't know. I'm going to listen to the developer song again.

Re: Aaah, selective memory.

Date: 2009-01-11 07:25 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] squidb0i.livejournal.com
Mmmm.. gargantuan sweat circles. =D

Date: 2009-01-10 06:40 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] telemann.livejournal.com
Both of these reasons may help explain why private companies almost always perform better than government agencies (Ex. FedEx vs. USPS).

Again a bullshit argument. Let me know when FedEx has to make daily deliveries to everyone including everything from junk mail to magazines and ordinary packages. Oh, but what about next day or express package deliveries you might say, Fed-Ex just has to be better? Not according to Consumer Reports: (http://consumerist.com/5072394/overnight-shipping-battle-fedex-vs-usps-vs-ups)

The Postal Service was the least expensive by far for local and long-distance deliveries. For letter-size envelopes, such as the ones it gave us for sending the books, it charges a flat rate of $16.50. (Flat rates for slower delivery are lower.) The other shippers base prices on weight and distance traveled. UPS charged $62.87 to send our book next-day to Oregon and $29.55 to Manhattan. FedEx charged $54.57 and $27.48, respectively.


Sorry to burst your bubble bud.

Date: 2009-01-10 07:18 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] reality-hammer.livejournal.com
As soon as Congress repeals the laws preventing them from doing that I'm sure they will.

Oh, and when FedEx loses money they have to either perform better or suffer the consequences. The USPS goes to Congress and gets approval to raise first class postage rates.

There you go again...

Date: 2009-01-10 08:09 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] telemann.livejournal.com
Bullshit, FedEx wouldn't have the same volume because they would place restrictions on services. Your point is pretty meaningless about the USPS going to Congress to get a rate increase- like FedEx doesn't raise its rates. Besides, FedEx and USPS fee increases in 2008 were pretty much the same (around 5.8 percent, mostly due to the oil price spike).

You gloss over Consumer Report's study that shows FedEx isn't any better than the USPS and is in fact, much much more expensive. Think your postage stamps are high now, wait until FedEx and other private companies are put in charge. *snicker*

Date: 2009-01-11 06:52 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] xforge.livejournal.com
FedEx loses money they have to either perform better or

go to the Fed and ask for a handout.

Date: 2009-01-09 10:36 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] savagemind.livejournal.com
If he says it, it must be true.

Date: 2009-01-09 10:02 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] dwer.livejournal.com
absurdity is a good tag for this absurd cartoon.

Do conservatives have any plans?

Date: 2009-01-09 10:39 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] savagemind.livejournal.com
I love how conservatives mock the things that have been historically successful and continue to tout alternatives that have historically been failures. If you say it enough times, it becomes true.

am i doin it rite?

Date: 2009-01-10 01:40 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] lafinjack.livejournal.com
ABSTINENCE ABSTINENCE ABSTINENCE ABSTINENCE ABSTINENCE ABSTINENCE ABSTINENCE ABSTINENCE ABSTINENCE

Re: am i doin it rite?

Date: 2009-01-10 03:25 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] savagemind.livejournal.com
Hmm...needs more abstinence.

Re: am i doin it rite?

Date: 2009-01-10 02:31 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fragbert.livejournal.com
It worked for the Virgin Mary. RIGHT?

Re: Do conservatives have any plans?

Date: 2009-01-10 02:54 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fleaplus.livejournal.com
Idiotic conservatives like Christina Romer?

Re: Do conservatives have any plans?

Date: 2009-01-10 03:24 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] savagemind.livejournal.com
Does she not like the idea of a few hundred thousand more jobs under Uncle Sam?

Re: Do conservatives have any plans?

Date: 2009-01-10 07:21 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] reality-hammer.livejournal.com
Historically successful?

Smoot-Hawley? Increasing taxes? o_O

Things that have actually been successful:

Across the board income tax rate cuts; cuts in taxes on long term capital gains; free trade.

Yeah, just was conservatives do support.

If government spending "cured" recessions how did we fall into one in the first place?
From: [identity profile] savagemind.livejournal.com
Image

Conservatism has failed. Unfortunately, in politics, failure isn't enough to actually stop something from continuing...

Date: 2009-01-10 04:18 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] jfboyd.livejournal.com
As a competent government worker, I have to say:

Fuck you, Stantis!

Date: 2009-01-10 06:26 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] squidb0i.livejournal.com
NO U R LIEK TEH UNIKORNZ AND NON-TERRIZT MUZLIMZ!
U DONT EXIST!

Date: 2009-01-10 07:24 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] reality-hammer.livejournal.com
Doesn't being in Ripley's Museum (http://www.ripleys.com/) hamper your work?
Edited Date: 2009-01-10 07:26 am (UTC)
(deleted comment)

Date: 2009-01-11 12:22 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] desidono.livejournal.com
THEY ARE ALL SPONGES DESIGNED FOR TAKING ALL MY MONEY!
(deleted comment)

Date: 2009-01-11 02:34 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] desidono.livejournal.com
RIGHT ON BUDDY BUT CONSUMER RPTS IS NON PROFIT AND I DONT TRUST ANYTHING THAT DOESNT HAVE A PROFIT!! MOTIVE.

Date: 2009-01-10 09:31 pm (UTC)
ext_2661: (Default)
From: [identity profile] jennem.livejournal.com
Since it took me 3 1/2 hours of waiting in line to change my name at the Social Security Administration, I think there are definitely instances where the government could hire more workers and actually put them to work.

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