We do? Provide links to what they said they would change, and show how they have lied. Also, explain who "they" are and how "they" speak for all Democrats.
PROMISE MADE: To lead the “most open” and “ethical” Congress in history. PROMISE BROKEN: Democrats have broken their promise to lead the most “open” and “ethical” Congress in history, failing to enact real lobbying and ethics reform, and ignoring the ethics problems of Congressman William Jefferson (D-LA).
PROMISE MADE: To make earmark requests and federal spending more transparent. PROMISE BROKEN: Democrats have broken their promise to make earmark requests and spending more transparent, actively working to make the earmark process secret and failing to change rules that allow the majority to certify “earmark free” bills that are actually loaded with earmarks.
PROMISE MADE: To be responsible stewards of the federal budget. PROMISE BROKEN: Democrats have broken their promise to continue fiscally responsible policies, having now authorized more than $98 billion in new federal spending this year alone and approving the largest tax hike in American history.
PROMISE MADE: To lower gas prices for consumers. PROMISE BROKEN: Democrats have broken their promise to lower gas prices while offering policies that actually make the problem worse.
Sounds like a sore loser to me. These are the facts and you don't want to accept them. Anyone can tell you that these are some of the promises the Dems made when they asked for power. Don't be stupid.
Wow, you try to debate in politics and not even know the basic facts. Thats all you have said here. You have basically asked me to prove common knowledge to you. Do you even know who the current president is or do you need a source for that to?
Please try to be more informed. These are the promises made and broken by the 110th congress and thats a fact. Now get over it that you are wrong.
PROMISE MADE: To lead the “most open” and “ethical” Congress in history. PROMISE BROKEN: Democrats have broken their promise to lead the most “open” and “ethical” Congress in history, failing to enact real lobbying and ethics reform, and ignoring the ethics problems of Congressman William Jefferson (D-LA).
1. The 110th congress has been in session for about 6 months. Even Bush's harshest critics gave him more time than that. Bills take time to be worked on and passed. As for Congressman Jefferson, he was stripped of his commitee appointments by the house leadership and has been indited by the Feds in anticipation of standing trial. So far, no one from either party has offered any special favors to him. In the meantime, until he is convicted, we can talk about Jack Abramoff, the indictment of former House Majority Leader Tom DeLay in a Texas court, and last year's guilty plea of California Rep. Randy "Duke" Cunningham, now serving an eight-year stretch for taking bribes from defense contractors.
PROMISE MADE: To make earmark requests and federal spending more transparent. PROMISE BROKEN: Democrats have broken their promise to make earmark requests and spending more transparent, actively working to make the earmark process secret and failing to change rules that allow the majority to certify “earmark free” bills that are actually loaded with earmarks.
I would love to see your proof on how this is the fault of any one party.
PROMISE MADE: To be responsible stewards of the federal budget. PROMISE BROKEN: Democrats have broken their promise to continue fiscally responsible policies, having now authorized more than $98 billion in new federal spending this year alone and approving the largest tax hike in American history.
Considering under the previous stewards, the national debt has doubled and the previous stewards attempted to build bridges to no where while cutting Paris Hilton's taxes, I think the current stewards are deserving of a bit more time to get the budget under control.
PROMISE MADE: To lower gas prices for consumers. PROMISE BROKEN: Democrats have broken their promise to lower gas prices while offering policies that actually make the problem worse.
Considering the huge tax breaks the past congress gave to the gas industry, how are the democrats now causing the gas prices to go up? BTW, it's this congress that has a new energy bill that would require vehicles to be more fuel efficent. Here is an article on it.
These are the facts. The Dems have broken the promises they made to get into power. You will be mad and thats ok but take it out on the right people, the people the made these promises and then broke them.
The "I know you are but what am I" response is pretty old, not to mention childish, but consdiering your track record, I shouldnt be suprised.. Also, your "facts" would be a bit more crediable if they didn't come from such biased sources. Try finding me something from something a bit more non partisan and then we'll talk.
"So, I can see you don't like having the same insults you use, used back on you. Next time think about that before you insult."
No, I simply expect you to come up with your own retorts instead of parrioting back whatever I say, but I guess I'm expecting too much from you.
Can you prove they are right? You've made the accusations. The burden of proof lies with you. Simply posting talking points from a biased source is not a well researched answer. If that's all you've got, thats fine but don't expect me to belive your sources or do your homework for you.
Why? You sound mad that I used your insult against you...next time think about how it feels before using them, though I could be expecting too much from you to think that you would think.
Did you read any of the links?, they use sources and its all there. You are wrong. The promises were made and then broken. Thats the facts.
The fact that you don't read them because they aren't sources you likes shows how much of a child you are. Any responcible person can read the source and pull out the facts. Try again or admit you are wrong because the facts are against you.
Well, the facts are against you and I am sorry that you got mad because you are wrong. I would change it if I could, but I can't. These are the facts. Not the left facts, not the right facts, the natural facts.
The Dems made promises. They broke promises. Not matter where these facts are posted, they are facts.
PS. You refuted the claims by saying that you think they aren't real. Thats not a real intelligent way to refute claims in a debate.
I repeat - the links you provided are opinions, not facts and there's a difference. I'm not saying that what you're saying is wrong because of that, but what I am saying is that if you want to bolster your case, providing links to puff pieces from the leader of the opposition isn't the way to do it.
Those are the promises made, and those are the promises broken by the Democrat party when running for congress.
This is not an opinion this is a fact, even if it is posted on the Republican page, that doesn't make it less real. Thats like saying if global warming is posted on a green web page it can't be true.
And all I'm trying to say is that if what you're seeking is to create a convincing, sourced argument for your cause then the majority of people aren't going to trust something coming from the mouth of the leader of the opposition. It makes it harder to sell the points you're making, not easier, and invites conflict rather than true discussion and debate.
I was just on my walk, and a dog barked at me. I kept on walking, and now the dog is convinced it scared me away with its superior logic. Reminded me of something for a moment, but whatever it was couldn't have been too important.
I agree that the dems are not making good on their ethics and transparency promises, which is very sad considering the crap the republicans pulled. They should strive to be better, much much better, than them.
I agree that earmarks are bad, but I think the dems are being much less brazen about them. After all, it's only pork if it's not in your district. But, admittedly, the current US budget is a mess, thanks to the adminstration and their allies in congress and it's going to take a lot of work to get us out of that hole.
I believe that the dems are being responsible stewards, especially in comparison to the last "stewards." If you want to balance the budget, get a democrat in office... Clinton managed to do it, no?
Gas prices are a red herring. I don't remember them promising to lower gas prices personally, but I'm a transit guy so I don't pay much attention to that.
"I agree that the dems are not making good on their ethics and transparency promises.." Yeah, we agree on this. Pointing at a wrong to justify another wrong doesn't work. They made a promise and they are breaking it.
Again, they are breaking their promise and you are justifying it by saying look at the other guys. What is wrong is wrong.
The third point again, you point to the last group while trying to avoid the broken promise of this group. Clinton also had the highest retroactive tax hike in history, though this congress is trying to beat it.
You have a point here, it doesn't effect you so its ok for you not to care about it. This isn't sarcastic.
On point #2 - I think that earmarks are wrong period, no matter what party is doing it. I just think they're being less hush hush and under the table about it. It's less brazen, but it's still not okay.
On point #3 - The economy didn't seem to mind the tax hike and the US got it's financial house in order. Right now we're borrowing to pay for a war we can't afford. At some point, the bill will come due. If the Dems are going to raise taxes in order to balance the budget, I fully support that because it'd be cheaper to pay as we go than continue to finance it. Economics 101.
On point #4 - I think gas should be more expensive anyway. I realize I'm in the minority here, but damn, I wish both parties wouldn't pander to the gas price debate.
Everyone of those is a valid opinion. They have nothing to do with the disscussion at hand, but from some of your answers it seems that you have acknowledged that the dems have broken promises they made to get into congress.
I disagree that it doesn't have anything to do with the discussion at hand, but to your original point, yes, I think the democrats are not following all the platform pieces they used to get elected. With that said, they're a magnitude better than the opposition in this regard. Not saying it's good, just better than the alternative. This turns it from a black and white argument to one of greyscale and nuance.
I'm being a realist. The alternative is worse. I can support candidates who are ethical and don't believe in pork, but unless you're advocating for the overthrow of the US gov't, that's the only way one can impact change.
The reality is that instead of saying...well, I'm still being punched but not as hard as that guy punched me so its ok, you say, hey, I'm being punched and I need to stop it.
the second one is actualy really good. He misses the real reason why Isreal wants Fatah and not Hamas, but he doesnt really have the space to do it, even if they cartoonists were capable of seeing it.
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bluetooth16.livejournal.com) wrote in ![[community profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/community.png)
politicartoons2007-06-19 11:28 pm
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Don't forget to throw in the Sunni insurgents, too!
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"The difference between Fatah and Hamas is this:
Fatah wants to kill the jews. Hamas wants to killllll the jews."
Or something. I was drunk.
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PROMISE BROKEN: Democrats have broken their promise to lead the most “open” and “ethical” Congress in history, failing to enact real lobbying and ethics reform, and ignoring the ethics problems of Congressman William Jefferson (D-LA).
PROMISE MADE: To make earmark requests and federal spending more transparent.
PROMISE BROKEN: Democrats have broken their promise to make earmark requests and spending more transparent, actively working to make the earmark process secret and failing to change rules that allow the majority to certify “earmark free” bills that are actually loaded with earmarks.
PROMISE MADE: To be responsible stewards of the federal budget.
PROMISE BROKEN: Democrats have broken their promise to continue fiscally responsible policies, having now authorized more than $98 billion in new federal spending this year alone and approving the largest tax hike in American history.
PROMISE MADE: To lower gas prices for consumers.
PROMISE BROKEN: Democrats have broken their promise to lower gas prices while offering policies that actually make the problem worse.
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Please try to be more informed. These are the promises made and broken by the 110th congress and thats a fact. Now get over it that you are wrong.
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PROMISE BROKEN: Democrats have broken their promise to lead the most “open” and “ethical” Congress in history, failing to enact real lobbying and ethics reform, and ignoring the ethics problems of Congressman William Jefferson (D-LA).
1. The 110th congress has been in session for about 6 months. Even Bush's harshest critics gave him more time than that. Bills take time to be worked on and passed. As for Congressman Jefferson, he was stripped of his commitee appointments by the house leadership and has been indited by the Feds in anticipation of standing trial. So far, no one from either party has offered any special favors to him. In the meantime, until he is convicted, we can talk about Jack Abramoff, the indictment of former House Majority Leader Tom DeLay in a Texas court, and last year's guilty plea of California Rep. Randy "Duke" Cunningham, now serving an eight-year stretch for taking bribes from defense contractors.
PROMISE MADE: To make earmark requests and federal spending more transparent.
PROMISE BROKEN: Democrats have broken their promise to make earmark requests and spending more transparent, actively working to make the earmark process secret and failing to change rules that allow the majority to certify “earmark free” bills that are actually loaded with earmarks.
I would love to see your proof on how this is the fault of any one party.
PROMISE MADE: To be responsible stewards of the federal budget.
PROMISE BROKEN: Democrats have broken their promise to continue fiscally responsible policies, having now authorized more than $98 billion in new federal spending this year alone and approving the largest tax hike in American history.
Considering under the previous stewards, the national debt has doubled and the previous stewards attempted to build bridges to no where while cutting Paris Hilton's taxes, I think the current stewards are deserving of a bit more time to get the budget under control.
PROMISE MADE: To lower gas prices for consumers.
PROMISE BROKEN: Democrats have broken their promise to lower gas prices while offering policies that actually make the problem worse.
Considering the huge tax breaks the past congress gave to the gas industry, how are the democrats now causing the gas prices to go up? BTW, it's this congress that has a new energy bill that would require vehicles to be more fuel efficent. Here is an article on it.
http://money.cnn.com/2007/06/19/news/economy/senate_energy/index.htm?postversion=2007061918
Considering the amount of time you spend insulting people in the community, it would be nice to see you do your homework for once.
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1st promise: http://republicanleader.house.gov/News/DocumentSingle.aspx?DocumentID=66825
2nd promise:
http://republicanleader.house.gov/News/DocumentSingle.aspx?DocumentID=56728
3rd promise:
http://republicanleader.house.gov/News/DocumentSingle.aspx?DocumentID=66739
4th promise:
http://republicanleader.house.gov/News/DocumentSingle.aspx?DocumentID=66729
These are the facts. The Dems have broken the promises they made to get into power. You will be mad and thats ok but take it out on the right people, the people the made these promises and then broke them.
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Can you prove the source wrong or are you just trying to find an easy way to get out of being wrong? Try again.
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No, I simply expect you to come up with your own retorts instead of parrioting back whatever I say, but I guess I'm expecting too much from you.
Can you prove they are right? You've made the accusations. The burden of proof lies with you. Simply posting talking points from a biased source is not a well researched answer. If that's all you've got, thats fine but don't expect me to belive your sources or do your homework for you.
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Did you read any of the links?, they use sources and its all there. You are wrong. The promises were made and then broken. Thats the facts.
The fact that you don't read them because they aren't sources you likes shows how much of a child you are. Any responcible person can read the source and pull out the facts. Try again or admit you are wrong because the facts are against you.
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All the links were read, and I've already refuted the claims made previously.
Have a nice day.
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The Dems made promises. They broke promises. Not matter where these facts are posted, they are facts.
PS. You refuted the claims by saying that you think they aren't real. Thats not a real intelligent way to refute claims in a debate.
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Again, I am sorry that you are wrong but I can't change the facts.
Now, have a goodnight.
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This is not an opinion this is a fact, even if it is posted on the Republican page, that doesn't make it less real. Thats like saying if global warming is posted on a green web page it can't be true.
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And all I'm trying to say is that if what you're seeking is to create a convincing, sourced argument for your cause then the majority of people aren't going to trust something coming from the mouth of the leader of the opposition. It makes it harder to sell the points you're making, not easier, and invites conflict rather than true discussion and debate.
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I agree that earmarks are bad, but I think the dems are being much less brazen about them. After all, it's only pork if it's not in your district. But, admittedly, the current US budget is a mess, thanks to the adminstration and their allies in congress and it's going to take a lot of work to get us out of that hole.
I believe that the dems are being responsible stewards, especially in comparison to the last "stewards." If you want to balance the budget, get a democrat in office... Clinton managed to do it, no?
Gas prices are a red herring. I don't remember them promising to lower gas prices personally, but I'm a transit guy so I don't pay much attention to that.
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Yeah, we agree on this. Pointing at a wrong to justify another wrong doesn't work. They made a promise and they are breaking it.
Again, they are breaking their promise and you are justifying it by saying look at the other guys. What is wrong is wrong.
The third point again, you point to the last group while trying to avoid the broken promise of this group. Clinton also had the highest retroactive tax hike in history, though this congress is trying to beat it.
You have a point here, it doesn't effect you so its ok for you not to care about it. This isn't sarcastic.
Thanks for being reasonable.
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On point #3 - The economy didn't seem to mind the tax hike and the US got it's financial house in order. Right now we're borrowing to pay for a war we can't afford. At some point, the bill will come due. If the Dems are going to raise taxes in order to balance the budget, I fully support that because it'd be cheaper to pay as we go than continue to finance it. Economics 101.
On point #4 - I think gas should be more expensive anyway. I realize I'm in the minority here, but damn, I wish both parties wouldn't pander to the gas price debate.
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You are still staying its ok and we should tolerate the broken promises because they are better than the others.
This is pointing at bad behavior to justify bad behavior, not good.
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