Hate Free Zone!

[tigron-x.livejournal.com]

Comments

[wight1984.livejournal.com]

I responded to that link in the comment above yours: Reply to Garote (http://politicartoons.livejournal.com/5060820.html?thread=109219028#t109219028)

Here's some linkspam as to provide context for why I don't agree.

First, responses from the 'alt-right'

Richard Spencer's reaction video in full: 'My video on the attacks on me and what the AltRight can learn from it. (https://twitter.com/RichardBSpencer/status/823178714506788865)'

Milo's compilation video of left-wing violence: Violence At Berkeley For Milo Event (Compilation #1) (https://www.facebook.com/myiannopoulos/videos/836229473181616/?hc_location=ufi)

Discussion and observations of the consequences

Article on whether being banned, no-platformed and protested really hurts people like people like Milo: 'I Helped Create the Milo Trolling Playbook. You Should Stop Playing Right Into It (http://observer.com/2017/02/i-helped-create-the-milo-trolling-playbook-you-should-stop-playing-right-into-it/)'

Screenshot of Milo's book as a best seller on Amazon: Dangerous, Best seller (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10211806589824947&set=a.1264682621928.40233.1375630950&type=3&theater)

Interest in Milo as expressed via google over the five years: Google Trends (https://www.google.com/trends/explore?q=Milo%20Yiannopoulos)

Some Academic Sources

Study of violent and non-violent protest during the civil rights movement: Do Protests Matter? Evidence from the 1960s Black Insurgency Omar Wasow February 2, 2017 (http://www.omarwasow.com/Protests_on_Voting.pdf)

Findings on the political consequences of the London riots: The impact of the riots: people feel more threatened and prejudiced Published by Steven Fielding on September 5, 2011 (http://nottspolitics.org/2011/09/05/the-impact-of-the-riots-people-feel-more-threatened-and-prejudiced/)

Brief thoughts from me

I'm not a pacifist; I do not reject the use of violence in all situations and all contexts, I'm just cautious of it's use.

The Spencer video doesn't show Spencer doing or saying anything vile or even controversial. It just shows an unprovoked and cowardly attack. Meanwhile, most people are not familiar with Spencer's views, so lack the context that antifa have for cheering the protester. In terms of basic PR, this seems like a clear fail.

Milo has made a career out of being controversial. He's not especially intelligent or insightful and his talks are fairly juvenile, but he gets media attention because people hate him. he's to politics what Kate Hopkins is to journalism; he exists and thrives on other people's hatred of his work.

[tcpip.livejournal.com]

> Richard Spencer's reaction video in full:<

Yes, at 16.49 he makes it clear that if they're shut out of the public they're not going to win. So...

> In terms of basic PR, this seems like a clear fail.<

Given the entire debate has been around "Is it OK to punch Nazis?", I think it's been a success. People have remixed the incident with music videos. People are cheering, and reposting it everywhere. The very tweet that you linked has this.

I'll read the academic studies later, but as many have pointed out people holding hands and singing Kumbaya doesn't have a good historical record of success.

[wight1984.livejournal.com]

"at 16.49 he makes it clear that if they're shut out of the public they're not going to win."

A sucker-punch isn't going to keep him out of the public... so just how violent does this need to get to stop him? Given the controversy over a sucker-punch, how well do you expect more severe forms of violence to play in the media and across the general public?

"Given the entire debate has been around "Is it OK to punch Nazis?", I think it's been a success. People have remixed the incident with music videos. People are cheering, and reposting it everywhere. The very tweet that you linked has this."

My observation is that the reaction varies according to pre-existing political bias.

For bubbles on the left, a divide has opened up between 'leftists', who tend to celebrate and those who condemn the punch and 'liberals', who tend to condemn it. For people on the right, this is just more evidence of how left-wing stances on 'tolerance' are hollow.

That's already not a great picture without thinking about how this may have affected the opinions and prejudices with those with a weaker sense of political identity and less partisan bias.

[tcpip.livejournal.com]

> For bubbles on the left, a divide has opened up between 'leftists', who tend to celebrate and those who condemn the punch and 'liberals', who tend to condemn it. For people on the right, this is just more evidence of how left-wing stances on 'tolerance' are hollow.<

Whatever happened to "I tolerate everything except intolerance"?

If liberals and conservatives think that advocates have a "right to free speech" (and a right to defame groups) then its become a very sad state of affairs for them.